Li Zheng: General Secretary Xi Jinping emphasized the close integration of high-quality population development with high-quality people's lives, and the close integration of 'investing in goods' with' investing in people '. The proposal for the 15th Five Year Plan proposes to "adhere to the close integration of benefiting people's livelihoods and promoting consumption, investing in goods and investing in people". From an investment perspective, what are the main aspects of investing in people and how is it different from investing in things? Tian Xuan: Investing in people is essentially implementing the people-centered development concept, investing more resources in the comprehensive development of people, mainly including education investment, health investment, social security and welfare investment, employment and entrepreneurship support investment, etc. The main changes from "things" to "people" are reflected in several aspects: from the perspective of investment objects and value forms, investing in people with laborers as the object forms intangible human capital, and the value measurement is diverse and complex; From the perspective of return cycle, investing in people is a long-term process, with relatively lagging returns but lasting stability; From the perspective of social effects, human capital has the ability to self enhance and adapt. Investing in people has broad social effects and positive externalities, which can effectively improve the quality and efficiency of economic and social development. Li Zheng: It is clearly stated that investing in goods and investing in people should be closely integrated. Behind this is a profound adjustment in development ideas and macroeconomic governance, which is mainly reflected in what aspects? Tian Xuan: Reflected in profound adjustments in three aspects. The driving force of growth has shifted from factor driven to innovation driven, investing in material inputs that rely on goods, and investing in people that focus on improving the quality of human resources, with more emphasis on enhancing innovation capabilities and stimulating innovation momentum; Economic development has shifted from focusing on overall output to optimizing structure. Investing in people can better fill the gaps in people's livelihoods, optimize income distribution, and promote economic structural upgrading and better match supply and demand; The macroeconomic governance goals place greater emphasis on long-term sustainable development, demonstrating the art of macroeconomic regulation that balances short-term growth and long-term development. Li Zheng: There is a deep connection between investing in things and investing in people. Investing in things objectively promotes comprehensive human development, while investing in people also drives investment in material foundations. Tian Xuan: Investing in goods can yield immediate results, but as China's fixed asset scale expands significantly, the marginal rate of return on investment will decrease. Therefore, achieving mutual promotion and progress between investing in goods and investing in people can expand the overall investment efficiency. On the one hand, it is necessary to improve the efficiency of investing in people, build a precise human capital investment system, focus on education, health, skills, livelihood and other fields, increase investment in inclusive human capital, create high-quality human resources, and promote high-quality population development. In this process, it is necessary to deepen the reform of registered residence registration, social security, professional title and other systems, break down the institutional barriers that restrict the flow of human resources, improve the incentive mechanism of intellectual property rights, equity dividend and other mechanisms, so that the value of human capital can fully appear in the distribution system, and the benefits of investing in people can continue to rise. On the other hand, it is necessary to use systematic thinking to coordinate investment layout, promote the coordinated implementation of investment in major scientific and technological infrastructure, industrial innovation platforms, and high-level talent attraction, scientific research team construction, etc., and promote the organic connection between the education chain, talent chain, industrial chain, and innovation chain. Li Zheng: The "15th Five Year Plan" proposes to "lead new supply with new demand and create new demand with new supply". How to achieve a higher level of dynamic balance between new supply and new demand by closely integrating investment in goods and investment in people? Tian Xuan: Human beings are the most active factor in productivity and also the main consumers who achieve ultimate needs. Therefore, investing in people can actually generate a driving force on both the supply and demand sides, which is a key point to smooth the domestic circulation. On the supply side, investing in goods and investing in people is closely integrated, which not only greatly improves the quality and innovation ability of workers, but also optimizes labor materials and labor objects, thereby achieving a leap in the combination of workers, labor materials, labor objects, and their optimization. This will continuously stimulate new quality productivity and inject strong new momentum into high-quality development. On the demand side, investing in people means strengthening social security, improving people's well-being, and enhancing the overall level of human capital. This can not only enhance the level of demand, achieve a higher level of dynamic balance between supply creating demand and demand driving supply, but also promote solid steps towards common prosperity, achieving a win-win situation for economic development and improvement of people's livelihoods. Li Zheng: Investing in people is not only a means to promote development, but also reflects the concept of development. From a broader perspective, in the historical process of transitioning from middle-income countries to high-income countries and then to moderately developed countries, the role and value of human beings have been more prominently demonstrated. In technological innovation, more emphasis is placed on talent cultivation; Opening up a new track of humanistic economy in expanding domestic demand; In the international circulation, both the "Chinese economy" and the "Chinese economy" are valued... With the goal of promoting comprehensive human development and maximizing creativity, the Chinese economy will rise to new heights with the support of over 1.4 billion people. Tian Xuan, Dean of the National Institute of Finance at Tsinghua University